24 May 2013

Baden-Baden Free Jazz Meeting 1969

Some of you may recall this album which was out on the MPS label in 1970. It featured American and European musicians in the free jazz idiom, many of the former affiliated with the Association for the Advancement of Creative Musicians (AACM), based in Chicago. The colloquial title, "Gittin' to know y'all" underlined the Baden-Baden sessions as a meeting point and as a meeting of minds.

Of course, the record could only be an excerpt of everything that happened, so here is a much fuller compilation of the meetings. I can't say whether this one is truly comprehensive, but in any case, what's on the table are approximately three and half hours of collaborations. This is a follow-up to earlier postings of the 1967, 1971 and 1976 meetings. We still have the 1970 and 1977 sessions to go, so hang in there.

The facts of the matter:

 va - Baden-Baden Free Jazz Meeting

 Disc 1

1-Hollow's Ecliptic No. 3 (J. Jarman) [18:09] Jarman (fl, p, voc); Mitchell (piccolo); Burrell (p); Krog (voc). Texts by Eldridge Cleaver and Joseph Jarman.
2-Announcement [2:56]
3-Getting to Know You All (L. Bowie) [34:41] Baden-Baden New Jazz Orchestra. Solos: Rypdal, Phillips (L) - Danielsson (R), Cuypers (prep-p), Burrell (p), Wheeler, Mangelsdorff, Mitchell - Jarman
4-Down with the Revisionists (B. Rosengren) [13:37] Thelin (tb); Rosengren (fl, ts); Cuypers (p); Rypdal (g); Danielsson (b - right); Phillips (b - left); Oxley (d - right); Delcloo (d - left)

Disc 2

1-Babudah (S. McCall) [17:04] Baden-Baden New Jazz Orchestra. Solos: Skidmore (ts); Wheeler (flh); Dudek (bamboo fl); Thelin (tb); Breuker (cl); Mitchell (as); Bowie (tpt)
2-Glancing Backwards (for Junior) (J. Surman) [10:45] Baden-Baden New Jazz Orchestra
3-Now (D. Burrell) (part 1) [15:37] Baden-Baden New Jazz Orchestra
4-Now (D. Burrell) (part 2) [13:16] Baden-Baden New Jazz Orchestra
5-Unknown Title [13:06] Wheeler (flh); Thelin (tb); Rosengren (ts); Sauer (ts); Skidmore (ts); Phillips (b); Danielsson (b); Oxley (d); McCall (d)
6-Unknown Title [1:33] Mangelsdorff (tb + ring modulator) 

Disc 3

1-Open Space (A. Mangelsdorff) [17:26] Mangelsdorff (tb); Sauer (ts); Surman (bs); unknown rhythm section
2-Hello Soerste (K. Krog-J. Surman) [7:46] Wheeler (flh); Sauer (ts); Skidmore (ts); Surman (p); Phillips (b); Danielsson (b); Oxley (d); Krog (voc)
3-Unknown Title [7:17] Wheeler (flh); Thelin (tb); Rosengren (ts); Sauer (ts); Skidmore (ts); Phillips (b); Danielsson (b); Oxley (d); McCall (d)
4-Unknown Title [5:44] Thelin (tb); Breuker (bcl); Phillips (b); Danielsson (b); Krog (voc)
5-Unknown Title [10:49] Baden-Baden New Jazz Orchestra
6-Ved Sørevatn (T. Rypdal) [8:38] Jarman (fl); Rosengren (fl, oboe); Rypdal (g); Phillips (b); Danielsson (b); McCall (d); Delcloo (d, glockenspiel); Krog (voc)
7-Unknown Title [8:24] Jarman (fl); Rosengren (fl, oboe); Rypdal (g); Phillips (b); Danielsson (b); McCall (perc); Oxley (perc); Krog (voc)
Unknown Title [4:xx] Phillips (b); Danielsson (b)

Kenny Wheeler (flh)
Hugh Steinmetz (tpt)
Lester Bowie (tpt)
Eje Thelin (tb)
Albert Mangelsdorff (tb
Roscoe Mitchell (ss, as, fl
John Surman (ss, bs)
Joseph Jarman (as, voc);
Willem Breuker (ts, cl);
Bernt Rosengren (ts, fl, oboe);
Alan Skidmore (ts);
Gerd Dudek (ts, fl);
Heinz Sauer (ts);
Terje Rypdal (g);
Dave Burrell (p, celeste)
Leo Cuypers (p, prep-p)
Palle Danielsson (b)
Barre Phillips (b)
Arjen Gorter (b)
Steve McCall (d)
Tony Oxley (d, perc);
Claude Delcloo (d);
Karin Krog (voc, p);
Unknown (ann)

 Recorded at Südwestfunk Studios, Baden-Baden
 (Dec 1969, Bootleg)

 Thanks to blogger chum Sotise for mailing me these nuggets alongside a bunch of other goodies.


Onx has kindly supplied me with a significant upgrade to this set. This new set is spread over four cds, is in the lossless flac format and adds further tracks, including the two short remaining tracks on the original lp release as seen above. As the track sequence is slightly different, I'm posting the set again in the order they appear on the four cds:

CD 1
01. Introduction 0:50
02. Babudah (S. McCall) 17:04
        Baden-Baden New Jazz Orchestra. Solos: Skidmore (ts); Wheeler (flh); Dudek (bamboo fl); Thelin (tb); Breuker (cl); Mitchell (as); Bowie (tpt)

03. Introduction 1:28
04. Hollow's Ecliptic No. 3 (J. Jarman) 18:09
        Jarman (fl, p, voc); Mitchell (piccolo); Burrell (p); Krog (voc). Texts by Eldridge Cleaver and Joseph Jarman

05. Introduction 0:56
06. Dear Uncle Alban (K. Krog-L. Cuypers) 3:20
        Cuypers (prep-p); Krog (voc)

07. Introduction 0:22
08. Forever (J. Surman) 4:16
        Jarman (as); Surman (bs); Phillips (b); McCall (d)

09. Introduction

CD 2
01. Introduction 2:56
02. Getting to Know You All (L. Bowie) 34:41
        Baden-Baden New Jazz Orchestra. Solos: Rypdal, Phillips (L) - Danielsson (R), Cuypers (prep-p), Burrell (p), Wheeler, Mangelsdorff, Mitchell - Jarman

03. Introduction 1:23
04. Now (D. Burrell) (part 1) 15:37
        Baden-Baden New Jazz Orchestra

05. Now (D. Burrell) (part 2) 13:16
        Baden-Baden New Jazz Orchestra

CD 3
01. Introduction 0:37
02. Everything is Water (K. Krog-R. Creeley) 11:50
        Krog (voc); Burrell (p); Gorter (b); Oxley (d - right); McCall (d - center); Delcloo (d - left)

03. Introduction 0:43
04. Down with the Revisionists (B. Rosengren) 13:37
        Thelin (tb); Rosengren (fl, ts); Cuypers (p); Rypdal (g); Danielsson (b - right); Phillips (b - left); Oxley (d - right); Delcloo (d - left)

05. Introduction 0:38
06. Hello Soerste (K. Krog-J. Surman) 7:46
        Wheeler (flh); Sauer (ts); Skidmore (ts); Surman (p); Phillips (b); Danielsson (b); Oxley (d); Krog (voc)

07. Introduction 0:15
08. Open Space (A. Mangelsdorff) 8:33
        Mangelsdorff (tb); Sauer (ts); Surman (bs); unknown rhythm section

09. Unknown Title 12:22
        Mangelsdorff (tb); Sauer (ts); Surman (bs); unknown rhythm section

10. Introduction 0:51
11. Ved Sørevatn (T. Rypdal) 8:38
        Jarman (fl); Rosengren (fl, oboe); Rypdal (g); Phillips (b); Danielsson (b); McCall (d); Delcloo (d, glockenspiel); Krog (voc)

12. Announcement

CD 4
01. Glancing Backwards (for Junior) (J. Surman) 10:45
        Baden-Baden New Jazz Orchestra

02. Unknown Title 13:06
        Wheeler (flh); Thelin (tb); Rosengren (ts); Sauer (ts); Skidmore (ts); Phillips (b); Danielsson (b); Oxley (d); McCall (d)

03. Unknown Title 7:17
        Wheeler (flh); Thelin (tb); Rodengren (ts); Sauer (ts); Skidmore (ts); Phillips (b); Danielsson (b); Oxley (d); McCall (d)

04. Unknown Title 10:49
        Baden-Baden New Jazz Orchestra

05. Unknown Title 8:24
        Jarman (fl); Rosengren (fl, oboe); Rypdal (g); Phillips (b); Danielsson (b); McCall (perc); Oxley (perc); Krog (voc)

06. Unknown Title 8:29
        Thelin (tb); Breuker (bcl); Phillips (b); Danielsson (b); Krog (voc)

07. Unknown Title 0:57
        Thelin (tb) Phillips (b); Krog (voc)

08. For My Two JBs (K. Krog) 1:09
        Krog (voc + ring modulator)

09. Unknown Title 1:33
        Mangelsdorff (tb + ring modulator)

10. May Hunting Song (W. Breuker-J. Surman) 4:50
        Breuker (bcl); Surman (bcl)

Four of these tunes -- "Gittin' to Know You All," "Ved Sørevatn," "For My Two JBs," and "May Hunting Song" -- are included on MPS 15269.

New links in the comments.


kinabalu said...

Links (mp3):


Pete said...

Wow, thanks! Can't wait to dig into this!

Reimer said...

Sterling work!! Thanks!


jim said...

I have the JAP MINI LP single CD release of this historic meeting, never thought I would get to hear the complete event. Definitely a mind bending treat not to be missed. Thank you Kinabalu and Thank you Sotise! I think Terje used the violin bow prior to J.Page

Nick said...

Thanks k

Wallofsound said...

This really does deserve a wow!

Anonymous said...

Might a lossless version of this be available?

kinabalu said...

Not that I know of, but I'm sure there must be original tapes of these sessions.

Peter said...

What a pantheon!

Many thanks from me also, kin!

Anonymous said...

holy shit! this is fantastic! absolutely crazy stuff from the beginning till the end!
huge thank!


maready said...

Having just left a long thank you on another post, I'll keep it short here: I'm re-reading George Lewis's book about the AACM this morning, get to the part about 'Gittin to know y'all', realize I've never heard the music and immediately check at Inconstant Sol. Amazing! Thanks and more thanks.

kinabalu said...

New links:









Anonymous said...

went ahead, made my day.

Nick said...

Even better, thanks

Anonymous said...

yeah! that's way better! thanks much!


glmlr said...

One little detail which appears to have got lost here: the recording dates were 12/14 December 1969.

Anonymous said...


Since every little bit of organization helps, I posted the CD track lists and personnel as small, useful jpgs. Also a better "cover" for Gittin' to Know Y'all.


kinabalu said...

Thanks anon for special services. Btw, don't I know you from somewhere else?

JC said...

Thanks a lot for the efforts with this. Surely worthwhile.

-Otto- said...

Thank you. kinabalu, for the original post, the flac upgrade and all the detailed information - including the service provided by "terrific anonymous." Thanks!

SantosCurser said...

the RS link for cd_4 is DEAD I THINK???...

the res, cd_1, cd_2, cd_3, have some killer big band stuff...thanks for that!!!

SantosCurser said...
This comment has been removed by the author.
SantosCurser said...


If SOMEONE re-ups CD-4 I will reup them all on Zippy

kinabalu said...

I just retested the link for cd4 and it's still working.

SantosCurser said...

RS link for CD-4 is taking me to RS and acting like its real... but then when you try to download it says "Invalid Share"

But thanks for your work truly. So much you guys are doing here... I had so much of these musics at one time but due to my screwed up life lost them.

Andy said...

I just tested this. It works fine for me.

SantosCurser said...

Did I mention that RS is showing the page but then telling you it is an "invalid share" when you try to download it.

But the other 3 CD files are working well... great music!

kinabalu said...


This is of course another chapter in the continuing story of Rapid Shite doing its utmost to drive away its customers. With a premium account, it worked, but after logging out and then trying to download it, it quite rightly turned out to be an invalid share. So you have to go to the file, give it a new name and then a new code will be generated and once you're past that step, you find out that it will take three hours to download it. RS can go fuck themselves! I've spent a useless hour or so trying to figure out this shit.

SantosCurser said...

much appreciated, i guess i can figure out what u say to get it... yes 3 hours is pretty much standard for RS even if u have a free account (not anonymous.

I used to use only the torrent thing for a week out of a year, very rough terrain there sometimes.

I have only been in the music blogs for a couple weeks...it is still far more enlightening and satisfying then not having your wonderful efforts. "You" being inclusive of all your fine fellows, it must be a labor of love. The value to the artists is under-appreciated... the blogs increase the fan base, and our knowledge, exponentially.

SantosCurser said...

Aaaaah, I get it now,
Apparently I would have to use some of the functions I have on this free account they gave me to Import it into "myfiles" on RS...
but then they inform that "at present this only works with non-RS imports"... but they are expecting to add the feature at a later date....

I will leave this "Baden Baden 1969" page bookmarked for a while to see if you put it on a different server???
seriously, either way thanks for your work.
(I have a funny story about Art Ensemble of Chicago performance in Philly around 1980... the audience was a total of about 30 people, Univ of Penn "Foxhole Cafe," a young local, one of the few afro-americans in the audience, shows up with his tenor sax. I was young back then too, always wanted to do what this kid was doing, particularly at the Sun Ra shows which me and the pals would attend a few times a year, Sun Ra living in the neighborhood. So this kid waits for about an hour into the set when mitchell, jarmin, and bowie are all blowing at a fever pitch together.... he is sitting about 5 feet from them. Takes out his horn and starts screaming right along with them. We are like a few seats away and you dont even notice the kid till a few seconds into his playing... I start cheering the kid, Roscoe gives me a look like he wants to kill me more than the kid....LOL... (in my defense I was a kid too, the uninvited jammer did not really sync with the improvisation of AEC, but he didnt exactly ruin it either... new interesting live drama in the deluge.. which reminds me of another event at a Sun Ra show...lol) so AEC stopped playing, the kid was escorted off somewhere, out of ear shot, he was quite agitated after hearing me cheer him on he felt he deserved to be on the stage... he was escorted out while yelling about how great a musician he was, that he didnt smoke or drink...etc, etc. I wonder if any readers here might have been there) ... I was the sole guy that cheered the kid on.... so shoot me...lol
I had many times thought of doing the same thing at the Foxhole Cafe. Never had that kids nerve.

Andy said...


kinabalu said...

Thanks for your assistance, Andy. As a free user, I can still access that file, but it takes a couple of hours which is much longer than for some of the other file servers. And if I'm getting this right, it means that each and every file uploaded has be "reshared" and that new links have to be created for each?

Frankly, I'm using this service to save time and not having to worry about reuploading all the time. Now these changes require extra time and extra work, and I'm even paying for the damn thing! Go figure!

@sc: Fascinating story and you gave me an idea for a new post! AEC also played the Empty Foxhole back in March 1976 and I have two full sets, about three hours each, taken from the Dime torrents site. These are huge files, so I might post them on another file server. I'll look into it.

SantosCurser said...

well thankyou Mr. Andy, sir... i guess now I have to figure out how to post links on here... I assume that these fileservers one of them or more is free to upload to(and of course download from)... time to do some research.

The GF link took about 20 minutes to get a 300 mg...that is typical of my average-slow rate ISP.

SantosCurser said...

kinbalu, who knows maybe one of them is the set I was describing... which would be awesome... either way ur files portend awesomeness.

SantosCurser said...

I will be posting an update with the links (all 4... or maybe i make them bigger files..) to all files, I only will repack them so they will not match the existing ones exactly but should have the same fidelity.

But that may be a while as I still have never actually posted music files before so i will have to figure out the free and best way...meaning the longest lasting links as well...
That will be my foray into helping out rather than leeching.

JH15CD said...

"I See That We Meet Again"-- Jimi

Well I suppose since I kind of attempted a hijack of this thread, with stories, and promises and other BS, it is time I attempted to deliver on things. In advance I have to point out that this is my first try to put up this thing.
And I still dont see how to use 7zip to "rar" a "folder"... For that reason I am first trying to use Mega to simply give up a folder rather than a rar'd folder.
... baby steps for the novice...

But first let me point out something from willards wormhole... even though I dont see any sharing of this particualr music it is still worth taking not of at least due to the content lists and the 3 sample play files on the link
15 CD set of Jimi Hendrix outtakes and heretofore mostly unknown stuff for me:

SantosCurser said...
This comment has been removed by the author.
Anonymous said...

my freshman thesis:




(andy, above, had something to put at the end)

JH15CD said...

I notice that this link only works if you are in the "blogger comment section"... which anyone can get to even anonymously by clicking on 'Post a Comment' (at the bottom of all the comments):
(know what I mean?)

SantosCurser said...

Hey andy and jh15cd and and onxlob and kinbalo, and thanks to whoever for the great german show... got to say that i had not had time to listen to this stuff.... but now I know what that dude was saying about terje using a bow but zeppelin had it on their first album which was the same year so we can assume that Page and Rypdal likely had some contact... who knows who came up with it.

But this show, as great as all the musicians are on here, and as much influence as AEoC has on it... SHOW STOLEN BY RYPDAL(imho)... great music!

kinabalu said...

Thanks for the JH15CD tip. I wasn't aware of it.

I've no idea whether Rypdal knew of Led Zeppelin, but I would think he did. He came from a rock background, so I would recommend the Bleak House album and the one with Dream as vintage rock items. The jazz influence is stronger on the former than on the latter. Before that he was with the Vanguards which was heavily inspired by the Shadows!

I always liked the intro to Gittin' to know y'all where you hear Rypdal with Lester Bowie. My introduction to free jazz!

Anonymous said...

It would be great if somebody could reup the cd 4..thanks in advance

Andy said...

Look in the comments. The Gamefront link to CD4 is still live.

Anonymous said...

Gm does not work-open over here ( mexico city )
a GS re-up would be great...thanks again..

Anonymous said...

Can't get cd4. Any chance of a re-up on that?

Thanks so much for everything else.

Great Great Great blog.

Anonymous said...

Got cd4. Thanks.

SOTISE said...

Anyone able to repost CD 4,please ?
both the Gamefront and RS Links are gone.. Bums i missed the 4th disc...
Anyone? would be Very appreciative.

kinabalu said...



Anonymous said...


Can anyone post CDs 1-3. The links for 1-3, that work above, are part of a rar archive and will not open without rar 4. Unfortunately the CD 4 that kinabalu uploaded is an independent zip file and will not work in conjunction with the previous 1-3 rar files. Thanks for your help.

-Otto- said...

Anonymous Howdy,

the "freshman thesis" on mega consists of 3 independent archives (the links were posted 27 November 2013 05:02:00 GMT-8). They seem to all work just fine.


Anonymous said...

Thanks Otto,

For some reason they wouldn't open using UnRarX but would using Unarchiver. Weird.

-Otto- said...

Yeah, Anonymous. On a Mac the Unarchiver is almost like a Swiss Army knife for most/all archive formats and even does 7z archives. Keka may be a usable alternative too. I gave up on UnRarX a while ago.

apf said...

Thank you so much Anonymous ("freshman thesis") for Discs 1-3 and kinabalu for the re-up of Disc 4. All still working!

Ernst Grgo Nebhuth said...


TomP said...

Many thanks for the new links !! Did you know that some, if not all the tracks are mono, with the R-channel sounding better?

Ernst Grgo Nebhuth said...

Hi TomP - yes I was aware of some imperfections. Although I have not checked the files/sound as close as you.
All in all I still think the sound is good enough for a fine listening experience.

Solomon said...

Thank you!

SantosCurser said...
This comment has been removed by a blog administrator.
SantosCurser said...

Been so long since I have posted stuff that Mega changed on me.... here are the decrypted links:

BBNJM-69-1 https://mega.nz/#!PoAE3QrL!KaTOK1INjFgMoupWFAe19QDpIUpnnOx-O1bNtTa1Nmc
BBNJM-69-2 https://mega.nz/#!i4RiTKqb!Tast_371NvWt8hri5IoSmHM0PMtCoLQIib7R3uYrA-Q
BBNJM-69-3 https://mega.nz/#!vgZCCD4D!chBf3RQBYBAN20ljliWjuk8YbvAF1-B3R1VEveYmwxM
BBNJM-69-3 https://mega.nz/#!6xJgTbpR!Lzm0WxAMBmo-DnA5YEL-Alu-C5QeNM_0NZD-rEtIWEM

(moderator, u can just delete previous post... or leave it as a clue for some clueless dude aka likeme)

francisco santos said...